Crossposted from https://thebrainbin.org/m/germany@feddit.org/t/1945027
A small town in eastern Germany banned the installation of new Holocaust memorial plaques that mark the last known residence or workplace of Jews and other victims of the genocide.
The motion was proposed by the far-right Alternative for Germany (AfD) and the centre-right Christian Democratic Union (CDU)…
That’s just simply objectively not true, and US global economic sanctions have killed over 28 million people in the last fifty years alone, according to the Lancet.
Soviet people’s democracy was radically democratic in a way that no bourgeoise parliamentary democracy ever has been or ever could be. A cursory understanding of the origins and history of US ‘democracy’ makes it clear how completely absurd the notion is. The government is a committee for managing the affairs of the rich, and it has been since the very first moment that the worthy businessmen of the colonies gathered in each others mansions to split the profits of their stolen lands and conspire on how to keep the working class under control. The people of the United States have never decided a single thing in all of history, and the people of its subjugated colonies and vassal states have never even had the luxury of participating in its sham electoral pageantry.
There has never been a more brutally authoritarian, bloodsoaked nation than the United States, and the USSR is not only not close, is not only the opposite, but its violent dismemberment and the carving up of its society and economy by the US worldwide secret police actually did kill tens of millions of people - 16.9 million excess deaths by 2019 in fact, again according to the Lancet.
Furthermore, here is a map of the 1991 referendum on whether to keep the USSR
As you can see, an overwhelming supermajority of the population were in favor of keeping the Union together. However, Boris Yeltsin’s CIA-aided, illegal dissolution of the USSR was forced through with extreme violence, during which over two thousand counter-protesters were killed - including members of the state parliament, the democratically elected body that tried to stop him!
Here's the House of Soviets after Yeltsin ordered tanks to open fire on it after the parliament impeached him and tried to block his illegal dissolution of the Union.
But we were talking about Germany, so did you know? A higher proportion of judges and government ministers were (‘former’) members of the Nazi party in 1973, than the proportion of active Nazis in the Third Reich in 1943? Did you know the first head of NATO, Adolf Heusinger, was Hitler’s Chief of Staff? Or how about that West Germany had a social club for Wehrmacht soldiers that had invaded Africa.
Here's their badge!
The Nazis didn’t lose the war except where the USSR got to them, everywhere else they were seamlessly integrated back into the western financial capitalist empire from which they had spawned. Lebensraum was inspired by Manifest Destiny and paid for by British and US banks. And now, US state media gets to come along, point at the results of their brutal political intervention, of their pet reactionaries trying to erase the history of a previous brutal military intervention, and by implication blame it on the nation they destroyed.
What a lot of whataboutism. You didn’t directly answer a single one of my questions.
Look at the footnotes here.
CNN? The same CNN that is being blocked by the White House?
Look at the “Origins” tab of the Wikipedia article on whataboutism you linked and sit with your feelings for a second.
I’m familiar with its origins. My feeling is: I used the word accurately.
"The tactic behind whataboutism has been around for a long time. Rhetoricians generally consider it to be a form of tu quoque, which means “you too” in Latin and involves charging your accuser with whatever it is you’ve just been accused of rather than refuting the truth of the accusation made against you. Tu quoque is considered to be a logical fallacy, because whether or not the original accuser is likewise guilty of an offense has no bearing on the truth value of the original accusation.
Whataboutism adds a twist to tu quoque by directing its energies into establishing an equivalence between two or more disparate actions…
The association of whataboutism with the Soviet Union began during the Cold War. As the regimes of Josef Stalin and his successors were criticized by the West for human rights atrocities, the Soviet propaganda machine would be ready with a comeback alleging atrocities of equal reprehensibility for which the West was guilty."
doesn’t mean shit, just a crappy excuse to spout a lot of bullshit made up in your head and using “whataboutism” to deflect any criticism or points being made that contradicts your fantasy.
“Whataboutism” has a specific meaning. I used the word correctly.
No, he has proven that your claim that the Soviet Union was not democratic was wrong, providing an explanation and specific examples. Furthermore, he compared the number of deaths attributed to the Soviet Union with the figures for other states.
That’s not whataboutism at all, and pointing out how utterly ignorant you are of even the most basic information about the subject under discussion, and how that led to you asking a bunch of irrelevant questions based on your absolutely incorrect assumptions is answering the questions behind your questions.
Besides, I see you didn’t even bother to reply to the person who did answer all of your questions specifically with well sourced answers.
Seems more like you’re trying to shit on communism and disingenuously spread long-debunked horse shit propaganda than like you’re trying to have any genuine discussions.
I asked 3 questions.
Instead of answering any, CascadeOfLight posted an irrelevant rant about US sanctions, Yeltsin, West Germany in the 1970s, Lebensraum, etc.
That is absolutely whataboutism.
Point me to exactly where someone “did answer all [my] questions specifically with well sourced answers”.
Oh, you can’t, because no-one did do that.
The fact that you think it is irrelevant says much more about you than I fear you realize; I do hope one day you can actually engage with a different version of reality than what you’ve initially been presented with and engage with it scientifically.
Here https://lemmy.zip/comment/29096459
let’s see how you twist that into whataboutism
Blocked by Cloudflare :/
Skill issue.
Right, so its disingenuousness and not merely ignorance or naivete.
Whataboutism is a concept cooked up by a british columnist in order to dismiss IRA criticism of actions taken by the british army. It was then popularised by a zionist to dismiss palestinians.
Also, you’re using it wrong. “Whataboutism” is not just “whenever someone mentions anyone doing anything” it is especially not “whataboutism” when someone gives context to actions and accusations.
Yes. I think you are aware enough to understand how disingenuous your argument is.