So you are suggesting things would be the exact same if Trump hadn’t been voted in and that you were completely content and fine with a Trump presidency and Republicans holding all branches of power.
You are as much a Trump support as MAGA taking the side of downplaying how bad he is. No different in fact than smart Trump supporters readjusting their message of downplaying criticisms and trying to convince the left to not vote because both sides are equally bad, so please don’t vote.
Very smart right wing strategy of hiding their allegiance acting like they are a leftist, but doing what they can to discourage voting and trying to convince people both are bad since they know they can’t win them over to the right. So next thing is don’t vote.
Acting like not voting at all would fix anything is a huge part of the problem. Yeah the Democrats not going to do anything, but you know what that means, the Democrats won’t do anything. They won’t embarass America on the world stage every day, they won’t fund the Gestapo to assault minorities and they won’t threaten allies with invasion.
Sure the Democrats suck, the whole damn system sucks but it’s a whole lot better for a whole lot of people when the Republicans are not in charge.
They won’t embarass America on the world stage every day, they won’t fund the Gestapo to assault minorities and they won’t threaten allies with invasion.
Yaaay we get decorum and stability at home so we can ignore the Palestinians / Yemenis / Somalis / etc being bombed overseas! Hopefully the bomb will even be dropped by a diverse team under the Dems!
That’s a single issue. I agree it’s shitty all around. But there are hundreds of issues that are more important. Namely allowing children to be molested, people dying from not having healthcare, and deporting parents and stranding children just to name a few.
It’s shitty all around. It’s even shittier when it turns into a pissing contest of shittiness.
I’m confused how supporting and engaging in genocide and bombing humans in multiple countries with unique circumstances is both a single issue separate to and less important than doing the same (without bombs) nearer to home.
I guess everyone has a different tolerance for blood on their hands…
Imagine you have a house that is managed by landlords. The landlords have changed ownership and management many times and allowed the plumbing and heating and electricity to become inoperable. Now there are termites.
At some point management put in an HOA and made it so the HOA kicks your neighbors out without any consideration.
We have bigger internal issues. It ain’t my blood. All Americans are fully aware we should not be financing anything like that.
The landlords are burning down houses on the other side of town with the renters trapped inside. Then they start doing the same in another neighborhood, then another in the city. When do you start thinking they’ll do the same to you regardless of the termites and rot?
Internal issues aren’t bigger. They’re more personally dangerous. You’re simply saying human life near you is more important than human life elsewhere. If absolutely nothing else, paying taxes makes it blood on Americans hands.
Given that the US is engaging in the wars it’s clear that not all Americans are fully aware. I mean there are still a ton of conservatives who are pro-Zionism.
That said i know the left is growing and stronger every day. I know there’s people trying to fix things. The people I’ve known who are most effective never considered the border when valuing the state’s actions.
Joe Biden had the files and did not release them, so miss me with the “only dems will save the kids” shit
I don’t know why you’re implying we need to pick one or the other, but claiming that (at most) 100 - 200 western children being molested takes precedence over thousands of Palestinian children being murdered displays your white supremacist mindset.
Parents being deported and stranding children is terrible. It is not more terrible than parents being murdered and children being murdered. What the fuck are you talking about?
The only reason its as ineffective as it is now is because of people like you spend a ridiculous amount of time and effort shaming those who might consider it.
Saying a third party couldn’t win is factually incorrect, yet its a common phrase on here isn’t it.
Only once has a third party candidate made much progress, and Perot was right-wing/libertarian. You can’t skip right to a third party presidential candidate without making progress with that party locally first, then in Congress. That just how this system works. You can pretend that enough people will spontaneously vote for your same third party candidate, but that’s a demonstrably a fantasy. You can claim that a vote reflects on your own morality rather than something strategic and practical, but that’s a view pushed by people hoping to take advantage of youth vanity and split the vote.
You can’t skip right to a third party presidential candidate without making progress with that party locally first
I swear to God. It’s like trying to tell a child you can’t have ice cream because you’re stranded on a desert island and they KEEP INSISTING that they want ice cream.
It’s infuriating.
Like, it isn’t complicated. You can’t start at the beginning of a board game, roll a 6, and move your piece 57 spaces to the end and win. That’s impossible.
It’s wild how many Americans exist outside reality.
This absolutely can happen, but its not popular in America. Americans just want to vote for their team, at least the majority of them.
And your example is absurd, Trump himself skipped the entire game, and then took over one of the parties.
The only wild thing here is that you lack any creative thought to find a better solution than to vote for democrats and hope the country doesn’t fall apart by the time you pass away.
And theoretically all humans can live in peace and harmony with one another. Doesn’t mean it’s happening.
Trump himself skipped the entire game
Yeah, but he ran as the candidate for one of the two main parties. That is in no way equivalent to a 3rd party presidential candidate winning. Your comparison is absurd.
The only wild thing here is that you lack any creative thought to find a better solution
My child. The only solution you’ve indicated is voting 3rd party, which I’ve clearly explained to you is not a viable option. That isn’t an opinion. It’s a fact. It’s a fact because no 3rd party has any influence. It’s a fact because the most popular 3rd party candidate can’t even break 1% of the votes.
Why do you choose to live in a fantasy? Is real life just too hard?
No, they’re right - the Constitution says the person who receives the most votes is President. With the added fuckery of the Slaver’s College, third parties have an unbelievably hard lift to get anywhere close to President.
It’s just not going to happen without a huge base, and there isn’t one. There never is. Just stunt candidates ripping people off for fun & profit.
Sort of, probability isn’t a set thing, and everyone analyzes it differently. Part of the reason it seems so improbable is because people keep saying it is.
The reality is though that the majority want either a republican or democrat, because a majority think America is a good country that just needs a little bit better leadership. I disagree with that assessment, and I won’t vote D or R again.
Part of the reason it seems so improbable is because people keep saying it is.
It’s improbable is because no grassroots movement has been able to fund enough advertisements to run a successful 3rd party run. It’s a 2 party system because of money; straight up. Money has to be used to reach votes in hard to reach places across all 50+ states that have varying tax laws. Not impossible, but over the 250+ years of elections (or whatever) it hasn’t been done.
It’s improbable because voting 3rd party also hopes that other folx agree with the 3rd party and will also vote. Voting 3rd party is throwing away your vote in a system that has been binary thus far. If the choices are voting for a literal Nazi or voting for a Corporate Puppet, and your and your friends vote 3rd party, that historically gives a better chance to either of the other 2 candidates winning, with the Nazi candidate benefiting the most.
There’s a lot of people in America; it’s a large piechart.
Hmm maybe a general strike would help then. I was going to say we should stop associating and giving our money to greedy capitalists, but thats a general strike so let’s so that.
Saying a third party couldn’t win is factually incorrect
Oh, you like facts?
Here’s one.
In the 2024 election the 3rd party presidential candidate with the most votes only got 0.5% of the total votes cast.
So it is FACTUALLY CORRECT to state a 3rd party can’t win the presidency.
Like, what do you not grasp here? No 3rd party has done the work to become nationally viable. No 3rd party even has a SINGLE member in Congress. It is ACTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE for a 3rd party candidate to win the presidency anytime in the remotely near future. It would take YEARS and YEARS for a 3rd party to become a household name and get members in Congress and actually have a shot at the presidency.
Therefore, voting for a 3rd party candidate for president is akin to wiping your ass with your ballot, smelling it and thinking it smells nice, then flushing it down the toilet.
Democrats are guilty of aiding, and in some cases directly participating in, an internationally-recognized genocide. You are advocating for genocidaires. Democrats are guilty of aiding, and in some cases directly participating in, an internationally-recognized genocide. You are advocating for genocidaires. Democrats are guilty of aiding, and in some cases directly participating in, an internationally-recognized genocide. You are advocating for genocidaires.
And you’re advocating for worse by allowing a worse party to win.
This isn’t complicated.
When Biden was president he tried to broker a peace deal. He stated on live TV that he didn’t condone Israel’s methods. And he floated arms shipment cancellations to try to bring Netanyahu to the table.
Trump, on the other hand, is giving Netanyahu two big thumbs up and talking about turning Gaza into a resort destination once all the Palestinians are dead or forcibly removed.
Now, do I need to explain to you how those things are not the same?
I do not care about your feelings. I care about my own nation’s wellbeing first, then after that, I care about helping the Palestinians as much as I can. And helping them as much as I can meant voting Dem, because, as I just made clear, Republicans are WAY WORSE for Palestinians.
Its a common strategy of pretending to be a leftist but playing up the both sides are bad, so don’t vote. Which is the go to strategy if they know the demographic they are targeting won’t vote right, so next best thing is apathy towards voting and taking them out of the equation.
When Biden was president he tried to broker a peace deal. He stated on live TV that he didn’t condone Israel’s methods. And he floated arms shipment cancellations to try to bring Netanyahu to the table.
Now, do I need to explain to you how those things are not the same?
“Although the end result was the exact same, one side feigned civility and decorum! How can you not see the difference?”
Yall need to drop this obsession with vibes, messaging, and optics.
Democrats are guilty of aiding, and in some cases directly participating in, an internationally-recognized genocide.
And Republicans eagerly participate in genocide as hard as they can… so when you only have 2 choices to compare, the one that does horrible things some times vs the one that only does horrible things and seeks to do the most horrible things all the time, you probably, maybe, want to go with the lesser evil
so when you only have 2 choices to compare […], you probably, maybe, want to go with the lesser evil
Suppose, in 10 years, your choice for president is between a democrat who openly expresses interest in murdering six million Jewish people, and a Republican who openly expresses interest in murdering seven million Jewish people.
Will you still be an unwavering Democrat?
get liberals to admit they would vote for a literal holocaust so long as the color is blue - with this one simple trick!
The Democrats move right when they see the Republicans win. Letting the Republicans win forces the Democrats to move right, because that’s where the votes of people who actually fucking vote go. The reverse would also be true. Letting the country drift further and further right by refusing to support or vote for the only people who would move it in even the least bit leftwards is a special form of brain dead crap.
What is it going to take to bring you back to reality?
Unless you, yes you personally, go on a quest and succeed in making a 3rd party viable in the U.S. (not going to happen), then you have exactly two choices.
If you don’t go for the least evil option when presented with two options, I have to just assume you’re evil.
And an evil person going around calling others supporters of genocidaires is just kind of comical.
Democratic voters might be decent people, they at least have good intentions for the most part. That does not mean that the solutions their politicians propose are effective or helpful. I’m glad you had cheap healthcare then, but if I starved you for a month and then gave you a meal you’d be thankful for that too.
You should probably go look at the voting history for the Democrat party before you continue this conversation.
I have.
And I don’t let a single vote that didn’t go the way I wanted to turn me off of a party, because then I’d be turned off from all parties, everywhere, forever.
Acting like voting D would fix anything is a huge part of the problem.
So you are suggesting things would be the exact same if Trump hadn’t been voted in and that you were completely content and fine with a Trump presidency and Republicans holding all branches of power.
You are as much a Trump support as MAGA taking the side of downplaying how bad he is. No different in fact than smart Trump supporters readjusting their message of downplaying criticisms and trying to convince the left to not vote because both sides are equally bad, so please don’t vote.
Very smart right wing strategy of hiding their allegiance acting like they are a leftist, but doing what they can to discourage voting and trying to convince people both are bad since they know they can’t win them over to the right. So next thing is don’t vote.
Acting like not voting at all would fix anything is a huge part of the problem. Yeah the Democrats not going to do anything, but you know what that means, the Democrats won’t do anything. They won’t embarass America on the world stage every day, they won’t fund the Gestapo to assault minorities and they won’t threaten allies with invasion.
Sure the Democrats suck, the whole damn system sucks but it’s a whole lot better for a whole lot of people when the Republicans are not in charge.
Yaaay we get decorum and stability at home so we can ignore the Palestinians / Yemenis / Somalis / etc being bombed overseas! Hopefully the bomb will even be dropped by a diverse team under the Dems!
That’s a single issue. I agree it’s shitty all around. But there are hundreds of issues that are more important. Namely allowing children to be molested, people dying from not having healthcare, and deporting parents and stranding children just to name a few.
It’s shitty all around. It’s even shittier when it turns into a pissing contest of shittiness.
I’m confused how supporting and engaging in genocide and bombing humans in multiple countries with unique circumstances is both a single issue separate to and less important than doing the same (without bombs) nearer to home.
I guess everyone has a different tolerance for blood on their hands…
Imagine you have a house that is managed by landlords. The landlords have changed ownership and management many times and allowed the plumbing and heating and electricity to become inoperable. Now there are termites.
At some point management put in an HOA and made it so the HOA kicks your neighbors out without any consideration.
We have bigger internal issues. It ain’t my blood. All Americans are fully aware we should not be financing anything like that.
The landlords are burning down houses on the other side of town with the renters trapped inside. Then they start doing the same in another neighborhood, then another in the city. When do you start thinking they’ll do the same to you regardless of the termites and rot?
Internal issues aren’t bigger. They’re more personally dangerous. You’re simply saying human life near you is more important than human life elsewhere. If absolutely nothing else, paying taxes makes it blood on Americans hands.
Given that the US is engaging in the wars it’s clear that not all Americans are fully aware. I mean there are still a ton of conservatives who are pro-Zionism.
That said i know the left is growing and stronger every day. I know there’s people trying to fix things. The people I’ve known who are most effective never considered the border when valuing the state’s actions.
Jesus Christ dude. You are insufferable. Read all the rest of your comments.
constant international war mongering and bombing innocents is a single issue? and not even a major one for you?
jfc death to amerikkka
Oh. So you are just a troll?
Kindly fuck off.
and Russia, and China, and every 1st world country of similar size. Wake up sheeple!
We are living through a time of international tug of war on political influence, resources, and land.
I wouldn’t advocate for not voting, voting third party would be my advice if you don’t want to personally get involved in politics.
Hope that advice only applies to local/state elections, cuz voting 3rd party for president is about as useful as an asshole on your elbow.
The only reason its as ineffective as it is now is because of people like you spend a ridiculous amount of time and effort shaming those who might consider it.
Saying a third party couldn’t win is factually incorrect, yet its a common phrase on here isn’t it.
Only once has a third party candidate made much progress, and Perot was right-wing/libertarian. You can’t skip right to a third party presidential candidate without making progress with that party locally first, then in Congress. That just how this system works. You can pretend that enough people will spontaneously vote for your same third party candidate, but that’s a demonstrably a fantasy. You can claim that a vote reflects on your own morality rather than something strategic and practical, but that’s a view pushed by people hoping to take advantage of youth vanity and split the vote.
I swear to God. It’s like trying to tell a child you can’t have ice cream because you’re stranded on a desert island and they KEEP INSISTING that they want ice cream.
It’s infuriating.
Like, it isn’t complicated. You can’t start at the beginning of a board game, roll a 6, and move your piece 57 spaces to the end and win. That’s impossible.
It’s wild how many Americans exist outside reality.
This absolutely can happen, but its not popular in America. Americans just want to vote for their team, at least the majority of them.
And your example is absurd, Trump himself skipped the entire game, and then took over one of the parties.
The only wild thing here is that you lack any creative thought to find a better solution than to vote for democrats and hope the country doesn’t fall apart by the time you pass away.
“Not popular” literally means it won’t happen, you are restating my point.
You know Trump ran in 2000, right? And that he isn’t a third-party candidate?
If you want to hijack the Democrats like Trump hijacked the Republicans, that’s a good strategy!
Give me a creative solution that understands the system, and the math involved, and I’m entirely on board. But wishing isn’t enough.
And theoretically all humans can live in peace and harmony with one another. Doesn’t mean it’s happening.
Yeah, but he ran as the candidate for one of the two main parties. That is in no way equivalent to a 3rd party presidential candidate winning. Your comparison is absurd.
My child. The only solution you’ve indicated is voting 3rd party, which I’ve clearly explained to you is not a viable option. That isn’t an opinion. It’s a fact. It’s a fact because no 3rd party has any influence. It’s a fact because the most popular 3rd party candidate can’t even break 1% of the votes.
Why do you choose to live in a fantasy? Is real life just too hard?
No, they’re right - the Constitution says the person who receives the most votes is President. With the added fuckery of the Slaver’s College, third parties have an unbelievably hard lift to get anywhere close to President.
It’s just not going to happen without a huge base, and there isn’t one. There never is. Just stunt candidates ripping people off for fun & profit.
Factually correct but improbable none-the-less.
Sort of, probability isn’t a set thing, and everyone analyzes it differently. Part of the reason it seems so improbable is because people keep saying it is.
The reality is though that the majority want either a republican or democrat, because a majority think America is a good country that just needs a little bit better leadership. I disagree with that assessment, and I won’t vote D or R again.
It’s improbable is because no grassroots movement has been able to fund enough advertisements to run a successful 3rd party run. It’s a 2 party system because of money; straight up. Money has to be used to reach votes in hard to reach places across all 50+ states that have varying tax laws. Not impossible, but over the 250+ years of elections (or whatever) it hasn’t been done.
It’s improbable because voting 3rd party also hopes that other folx agree with the 3rd party and will also vote. Voting 3rd party is throwing away your vote in a system that has been binary thus far. If the choices are voting for a literal Nazi or voting for a Corporate Puppet, and your and your friends vote 3rd party, that historically gives a better chance to either of the other 2 candidates winning, with the Nazi candidate benefiting the most.
There’s a lot of people in America; it’s a large piechart.
Hmm maybe a general strike would help then. I was going to say we should stop associating and giving our money to greedy capitalists, but thats a general strike so let’s so that.
You sound like a child trying to come to grips with reality and failing. It’s honestly pretty sad.
Well you really told me.
Oh, you like facts?
Here’s one.
In the 2024 election the 3rd party presidential candidate with the most votes only got 0.5% of the total votes cast.
So it is FACTUALLY CORRECT to state a 3rd party can’t win the presidency.
Like, what do you not grasp here? No 3rd party has done the work to become nationally viable. No 3rd party even has a SINGLE member in Congress. It is ACTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE for a 3rd party candidate to win the presidency anytime in the remotely near future. It would take YEARS and YEARS for a 3rd party to become a household name and get members in Congress and actually have a shot at the presidency.
Therefore, voting for a 3rd party candidate for president is akin to wiping your ass with your ballot, smelling it and thinking it smells nice, then flushing it down the toilet.
Well, if we can’t even agree what a fact is, what’s the point of debating this?
Are you stupid?
Jill Stein got 0.5% of the votes. Proving a 3rd party can’t even come close to winning.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_States_presidential_election#Results
Sure but that’s a different argument. I think people call that “moving the goal posts” or something.
Voting D is not the cure for cancer but it seems to be a viable chemo treatment… voting R is like feeding the cancer with yellow #5 and plutonium
Funny how there isn’t only two choices though.
You’re like a gambling addict that keeps saying “but a 1 in a million shot still has a chance to win” as you go bankrupt.
Seek help.
Thats why I’m here!
Not funny at all actually… but that is what you get when Muricans literally do fuck all to protect their own democracy
Democrats are guilty of aiding, and in some cases directly participating in, an internationally-recognized genocide. You are advocating for genocidaires. Democrats are guilty of aiding, and in some cases directly participating in, an internationally-recognized genocide. You are advocating for genocidaires. Democrats are guilty of aiding, and in some cases directly participating in, an internationally-recognized genocide. You are advocating for genocidaires.
And you’re advocating for worse by allowing a worse party to win.
This isn’t complicated.
When Biden was president he tried to broker a peace deal. He stated on live TV that he didn’t condone Israel’s methods. And he floated arms shipment cancellations to try to bring Netanyahu to the table.
Trump, on the other hand, is giving Netanyahu two big thumbs up and talking about turning Gaza into a resort destination once all the Palestinians are dead or forcibly removed.
Now, do I need to explain to you how those things are not the same?
I do not care about your feelings. I care about my own nation’s wellbeing first, then after that, I care about helping the Palestinians as much as I can. And helping them as much as I can meant voting Dem, because, as I just made clear, Republicans are WAY WORSE for Palestinians.
Its a common strategy of pretending to be a leftist but playing up the both sides are bad, so don’t vote. Which is the go to strategy if they know the demographic they are targeting won’t vote right, so next best thing is apathy towards voting and taking them out of the equation.
“Although the end result was the exact same, one side feigned civility and decorum! How can you not see the difference?”
Yall need to drop this obsession with vibes, messaging, and optics.
And Republicans eagerly participate in genocide as hard as they can… so when you only have 2 choices to compare, the one that does horrible things some times vs the one that only does horrible things and seeks to do the most horrible things all the time, you probably, maybe, want to go with the lesser evil
The lesser genocidaires (sic)
x3
“Neither” is a choice
lmao at least you’re honest with yourself, that’s more than most Dems. I don’t vote for genocidaires, period.
so you vote for the worst type of genocidaires or knowingly allow them to win by default… you surely are a bastion of morality
Suppose, in 10 years, your choice for president is between a democrat who openly expresses interest in murdering six million Jewish people, and a Republican who openly expresses interest in murdering seven million Jewish people.
Will you still be an unwavering Democrat?
The Democrats move right when they see the Republicans win. Letting the Republicans win forces the Democrats to move right, because that’s where the votes of people who actually fucking vote go. The reverse would also be true. Letting the country drift further and further right by refusing to support or vote for the only people who would move it in even the least bit leftwards is a special form of brain dead crap.
Would you vote for 1 extra million Jewish people to die and pat yourself in the back?
What is it going to take to bring you back to reality?
Unless you, yes you personally, go on a quest and succeed in making a 3rd party viable in the U.S. (not going to happen), then you have exactly two choices.
If you don’t go for the least evil option when presented with two options, I have to just assume you’re evil.
And an evil person going around calling others supporters of genocidaires is just kind of comical.
So who would you vote for in my scenario?
I will always vote for the lesser evil because I’m not an idiot. What is hard for you to understand here?
Dems gave me affordable healthcare when I was young and poor.
Last Dem was progressive as fuck, but everyone focused on his age because the TV told them to.
Voting records show Dems regularly vote in favor of average Americans and have for a long, long time.
Sorry bud, reality disagrees with your feelings.
Just because a party isn’t perfect doesn’t mean they aren’t beneficial.
Democratic voters might be decent people, they at least have good intentions for the most part. That does not mean that the solutions their politicians propose are effective or helpful. I’m glad you had cheap healthcare then, but if I starved you for a month and then gave you a meal you’d be thankful for that too.
You should probably go look at the voting history for the Democrat party before you continue this conversation.
I have.
And I don’t let a single vote that didn’t go the way I wanted to turn me off of a party, because then I’d be turned off from all parties, everywhere, forever.
My lefties in here like there isn’t any history of progressive change.
Sure, let me just go check every vote every member of the democratic party has made.
Willful ignorance is certainly a take.
Ok. Do it. You’ll be more educated.
I didn’t review EVERY VOTE EVER.
I went back in time, randomly selecting votes and seeing how Dems voted in comparison to Repubs.
I discovered a pattern of Dems consistently voting in favor of average Americans when Repubs almost never did so.
I’ve also been alive for enough decades to have actually witnessed this trend in real time.