• danc4498@lemmy.world
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    5 days ago

    I think Harris’s failure should be the clue that this isn’t right. You’re not going to win by courting conservatives

    • LibertyLizard@slrpnk.net
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      5 days ago

      How can it be wrong? Do you think there are more leftists than republicans? Or do you deny the math advantage of switchers vs those who might stay home?

      There are multiple reasons candidates fail. Harris failed largely because voters didn’t know her and they saw her as a stand in for Biden, who they were angry with. Also she had sort of a flailing campaign strategy. And being a black woman never helps in the US.

      I’m not arguing democrats or leftists should moderate their positions. My politics are probably not too different from yours. But the first step to solving the problem is understanding it. And this theory that there are 100 million sleeping American communists waiting to be unleashed doesn’t have any evidence behind it. So just running someone further left is not a cheat code for winning elections. There is a lot more to beating fascism than that.

      • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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        5 days ago

        How can it be wrong?

        You’re chasing people who hate you and abandoning voters to do it. Stop.

        I’m not arguing democrats or leftists should moderate their positions.

        But there’s a lot moooooooore fascists! We have to be just like them to win! That always works!!!

      • danc4498@lemmy.world
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        5 days ago

        Well, as an example, I think something like socialized healthcare could appeal to the majority of Americans. The only reason Democrats don’t press the issue is because they get money from health insurance companies.

        I think this goes for many issues seen as “leftist”. Rather than embracing the left, democrats have spent decades moving closer to the middle. This is the reason they’ve been losing. Pushing candidates like Hillary and Harris that give up ground to the right.

        I think they need to embrace the left, and work to convince middle America that their policies are good for everyone.

    • LifeInMultipleChoice@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      5 days ago

      Biden over there having got more votes than anyone in history like

      Either we are saying Biden went farther left, or is a direct conflict to this statement

      • TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world
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        5 days ago

        Biden went left. This is just objectively true. He literally just adopted the progressive policy positions his opponents had in exchange for them becoming surrogates.

        Harris went right. And she lost.

        Now Biden didn’t govern to the left. And that also clearly hurt him/ Kamala in 2024. But he objectively campaigned to court progressives.

        • LifeInMultipleChoice@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          5 days ago

          Please tell me how Biden went left? He clicked resume on the shit from Obamas presidency.

          Biden went left of Trump, that’s all. Which Harris was left of as well.

          Is there any actual examples of Harris going right of Biden?

          • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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            5 days ago

            Biden went left of Trump, that’s all.

            Biden went left of Clinton’s 2020 positions. It was all a lie.

            Is there any actual examples of Harris going right of Biden?

            Well, she said she wouldn’t change anything from how he did things. Then announced she would appoint a republican to her cabinet, which was further to the right than biden.

          • anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            5 days ago

            He ran on forgiving student loans, creating a public option, and codifying roe v wade

            Once he was in office he promptly forgot about all of them.

            • FiniteBanjo@feddit.onlineBanned from community
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              5 days ago

              He attempted all of those things. The student loans were blocked by Republicans and courts on 3 separate occasions, so he only managed to forgive $183Bn of student loans.

              The other two things were fillibustered by Republicans in the senate which at its highest DNC was a 51:49 w/ DNC Speakerwith 4 IND and before that a 49:51 w/ GOP speaker.

              The only way to obtain real progress is to remove Republicans down to less than 40 like we breifly achieved 16 years ago for 2 months in order to pass medicaid expansion, would have passed the public option if not for IND Leiberman.

              • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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                5 days ago

                He attempted all of those things.

                He pretended to.

                The other two things were fillibustered by Republicans in the senate which at its highest was a 51:49

                It would take 50 to end the filibuster forever. Democrats preferred to keep it around so you would have an excuse. After all, they didn’t need to end the filibuster to accomplish their only policy goal of leveling Gaza.

          • FiniteBanjo@feddit.onlineBanned from community
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            5 days ago

            Her policy stances were left of Biden but the average person doesn’t know jack shit about policy and instead only know she had the Chenneys on stage with her and George W’s endorsement.

            • TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world
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              5 days ago

              No, they weren’t, but the average banjo doesn’t know this.

              And to be clear, were talking about the manner in which a candidate campaigns.

              • FiniteBanjo@feddit.onlineBanned from community
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                5 days ago

                Her unrealized gains tax on over a million alone had the potential to save this country, since billionaires and multimillionaires generally gain untaxed income by leveraging their stocks with longterm collateral loans.

                • TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world
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                  5 days ago

                  The copium is real. I suppose some banjos are more average than others.

                  You can live in a delusional reality of your own creation, but you lost this one in October of 24. Harris was shit, she ran to the right, it cost us the election and and handed the country to fascism.

                  It’s what we said would happen before it happened. Its what we said was happening while it was happening. And, begrudgingly, we’ve been able to drag the majority perspective to understand the consequences of not pressuring Harris to shift left, of not shamelessly putting yourself behind candidates before they come to get your vote

                  The arguments I’ve been making have won. The Karen’s of the world get it now. The CNN voters get it now. They under stand how they were wrong for how they approached this in 24.

                  And I’ll drag you too, just like I have all the others. It’s been quite the journey, and I don’t mind you as comrade.

                  • FiniteBanjo@feddit.onlineBanned from community
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                    5 days ago

                    “Us”? I’ve never seen you on the side that opposes the GOP. You do nothing but shit on Democrats full time. I wouldn’t be surprised if you kept an AI poster of Trump up on your wall.

      • Bilb!@lemmy.ml
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        5 days ago

        I think that had more to do with COVID and Trump, but who knows. Anyway, 4 years later they lost.

          • AWistfulNihilist@lemmy.world
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            5 days ago

            Yes, the same election year of 2020 gave Biden the most votes in history, and Trump the second most votes in history behind him. Beating the pervious record holder, Obama.

            Kamala 2024 would have knocked Trump 2020 down to 3rd, but Trump 2024 retained 2nd place under Biden 2020. So it goes Biden 2020, Trump 2024, Kamala 2024, Trump 2020.

            Trump has the 2nd and 4th most votes in history. We are fucked.

      • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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        5 days ago

        And biden still only barely beat trump. After courting the left by running on policies the left likes such as raising the minimum wage, childcare, family leave, revisiting the public option, rescheduling cannabis and so on.

        Then he got into office and made it crystal clear that he wasn’t going to do any of that because his only priority was making sure netanyahu got whatever he wanted. He betrayed anyone on the left who voted for him.

        But congress got in his waaaay! They didn’t get in his way when he broke the Leahy law to sell weapons for genocide. Funny how the excuses evaporate when it’s the only thing any centrist has ever wanted.

        • AWistfulNihilist@lemmy.world
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          5 days ago

          Totally with a but, look at the percentage of people voting. Recent elections have had turn out percentages the US hasn’t seen since the 60s as well. The records are an indication of population growth, but they are also an indication of more people voting by percentage than do typically, to be fair.