If we can’t be bothered to vote in the primaries, wjy would anyone believe us that a progressive candidate would somehow lure millions more to vote?
As I know the comments will be, uhhh, fun, I’ve turned off reply notifications.
If we can’t be bothered to vote in the primaries, wjy would anyone believe us that a progressive candidate would somehow lure millions more to vote?
As I know the comments will be, uhhh, fun, I’ve turned off reply notifications.
I thankfully don’t live in US and have been financially protesting USA since the 2nd time Trump was elected. I also don’t need your help in learning what protesting means as I have breathed in enough tear gas to learn that lesson myself.
Sure, go vote Democrat. I am sure its their turn to rule anyways so that the capitalis war between the monarchs and the oligarchs can balance itself once again. I am sure they will take care of Trump (or whoever their next chosen prophet is) THIS TIME. They were so helpful last time they were elected doing jack shit for 4 fucking years. Then losing to a fascist clown just after 1 term. You live in this fantasy that these incompetent rich bastards will somehow save you, and it won’t be the same shit all over again in another 4 years.
Keep showing Democrats that no matter how disconnected they are from the American public, you will keep voting for them. Why? Because, it is the most important election in the history of America. As if you weren’t saying the same shit for however many years now, and as if you won’t say the same shit in the future. It will never be time to vote for 3rd parties. God forbid some people have other beliefs then “left of far right” party and want to show their support for candidates who represent themselves better. God forbid you might send them a message and ask for meaningful change by actually showing them that you do not support them.
The US has a two-party system. Period. That will not change anytime soon, if ever. And that presents unique challenges that countries with different systems do not have.
I’m not entirely sure from your rebuttal that you actually understand this fact.
I don’t disagree that things are fucked up, and I don’t disagree that the Dems are a bad party which by and large do not support their constituents. But let me be clear: there is no path outside of voting Democrat that has any chance of success of changing anything in the US. The only path forward is voting for the single opposition party.
What you’re saying is: it won’t matter anyway. Maybe you’re right. I’m also not disagreeing there. But we know from evidence that there is no other option which has any chance. And if the whole house of cards falls – as it is likely to do – I’d certainly rather tell my children that I did what I could based on an evidential position, regardless of how futile it may have ended up being.
What I won’t do is pretend that a third party vote will help. I won’t pretend that not voting will help. Those are the farcical ideas of a naïve idealist.
Its such an American response to be like “you guys don’t understand our system” thinking you are so special. I have lived in a multi party system that had the same party winning for 26 years. My fascist dictator was ruling over me way before Trump even knew what politics was. And you know what? We have the exact same arguments about wasting votes if you do not vote for the main opposition party.
I am not saying it does not matter. I am saying that you (and people like you) can’t keep doing the same thing and expect shit to change, and then put down people who are actually trying something different for once. You can’t keep supporting the status quo and then act all high and mighty because other people are actually sick of watching rich bureaucrats fight over who gets the bigger slice of the pie.
So what’s the plan? Are you hoping the Democrats will win every single election until the end of time? Talk about being naive.
Not voting or voting third party is not new. It’s not “for once”. It has been tried again and again in the US, and again and again, the outcomes were as expected: whichever candidate between the two main parties loses more votes to the tactic, loses the election.
Stop pretending it’s novel. It isn’t, and it always fails. There is nothing virtuous about being shown evidence and denying it. That’s called stupidity.
Oh its not new? Tell me, when was the last time that enough of you voted independent /3rd party to win the elections? Oh, it never happened? An independent winning seems like a new thing to me then, for once. “Oh but it’s not realistic for independents to win, there will be never enough people voting for them”, well then how the fuck do you expect them to win if you do not vote for them, because no one will vote for them. Do you not see this infinite loop that only seem to work out for Democrats and Republicans? Do you not see how they both want to keep things this way and therefore will never change anything meaningful?
You also seem to forget that a 3rd party DID BEAT a US major party before, coming 2nd place. Maybe not good enough for a win, but apparently its possible to beat a major party, when enough people vote for you. Funny how that works out.
You guys keep calling people traitors for voting differently than you, you keep putting not voting and voting for independents in the same bucket. You keep calling people naive and idealist, you keep belittling people’s convictions pretending to be a progressive. You say its not realistic to vote outside of Democrats (or Republicans) while ignoring the fact that our reality fucking us all anyways. Go keep being complicit in the system that allowed all this to happen if that’s whats going to keep your conscience clean. Or maybe you are just happy as long as the republicans don’t win, but then just accept the fact that you are just trying to do the bidding of your democrat daddies instead of pretending to not be happy with them either. I guarantee you will have more success trying to convince people.