• chilicheeselies@lemmy.world
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    3 hours ago

    The wet dream for big tech has been to get people to pay subscription fees for compute, just like businesses do for cloud hosting. They tried with Stadia to get people to play games hosted in the cloud, but that was never going to fly.

    With the compute demands of AI (which is comparable to a AAA game except for the largest models), they dont want to make the same mistake and let you have the compute. They see this as an oppurtunity for subscription fees for the earth.

    The fact that we cant get hardware for a reasonable price is an added bonus to this plan.

    All of this only works of everyone subscribes to this shit. Businesses will, because its just easier to manage it. Consumers though should not give in. If you want to run an agent, use a small local model.

    The best thing that can be done is to make local open source agents and models approachable for regular users. Right now, they arent.

  • GreenBeanMachine@lemmy.world
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    5 hours ago

    So there’s more supply than demand, meaning they should become really cheap. Right? That’s fucking good news.

    What collapse are you talking about? Profit collapse for greedy corporations?

    • floofloof@lemmy.caOP
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      4 hours ago

      Sure, you may be able to buy a cheaper motherboard for a while. But you’ll pay through the nose to populate it, hence the falling motherboard sales.

  • febra@lemmy.world
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    5 hours ago

    I have a home server waiting around for an SSD for a year now. I have the money, but I don’t like feeling like I’m getting scammed. So I’d rather wait for this market to collapse than give them my money.

  • farmgineer@nord.pub
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    5 hours ago

    I was originally thinking of grabbing parts as they go on sale finally (this PC is from 2018ish, I think, and I guess I could upgrade some bits), but I think I’m just going to wait and get a laptop. In part because I do less gaming, the gaming is less intense, and I’m thinking about trying to spend part of the year living outside of Japan which would make the logistics of shipping a heavy full tower around (or even mid if I downsized) just too much of a headache. Still not 100% sure, though.

  • msage@programming.dev
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    7 hours ago

    Can we create a fund with gamers, and then buy the manufacturers that go under?

    We need just one of each, MB, PS, GPU, hopefully something for CPU will be buyable as well.

    • boonhet@sopuli.xyz
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      6 hours ago

      For CPU and GPU, our options are mostly TSMC, Samsung and Intel. Nvidia and AMD don’t really have fabs. Any of those can also help with the other chips on a motherboard. Samsung also do NAND so they’d be the best to acquire.

      • Upgrayedd1776@sh.itjust.works
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        3 hours ago

        I think Samsung is going to get hit with helium shortages which are needed in fab, outside of hormuz the US is the only one with a locked supply

  • chunes@lemmy.world
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    13 hours ago

    How has this whole saga not been an obvious indictment of ‘the free market?’

    Big players shouldn’t be allowed to gobble up all the resources needed by small ones. How is it not obvious that they need to wait until production increases to meet their needs before embarking on their little project?

    • BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.cafe
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      3 hours ago

      There is no Free Market, that’s just a myth they tell us to allow them to do whatever they want. They don’t really want a true Free Market because it leads to Luigis.

    • Venator@lemmy.nz
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      10 hours ago

      The free market means the market is free to fuck you. Yes you in particular 😅

      • Upgrayedd1776@sh.itjust.works
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        3 hours ago

        mankind’s oldest trade, but doesnt compare to the fact that in 1998, The Undertaker threw Mankind off Hell In A Cell, and plummeted 16 ft through an announcer’s table.

      • kiranraine@reddthat.com
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        13 hours ago

        Then give me communism bc this free market shiz aint it. Giving us the scraps that AI doesn’t want is just nuts if we get anything at all. Esp since no one beyond billionaires want this ai crap

        • BeMoreCareful@lemmy.world
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          5 hours ago

          It’s like a dozen people gaming ever one else for the rest of the chairs on the Titanic.

          They want to buy the dip

  • shirro@aussie.zone
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    15 hours ago

    Who knew cartels were bad for markets? I am sure economists and regulators were screaming at legislators for years but I guess they couldn’t hear them over the sound of the bags of dirty lobbyist money landing on their desks.

    And then there are the financial “irregularities” funding the AI boom which are also not getting any attention.

  • eestileib@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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    23 hours ago

    AI is an amazing tool for fascists.

    Annihilate private access to computing, censor and rewrite all comms, destroy free software and the last remnants of education…

    Every single decision made for evil.

    And all these vendors who are locking themselves into one customer are about to learn why that’s a bad idea.

    • Tollana1234567@lemmy.today
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      8 hours ago

      AI is used as propaganda tools to spread it, and it can bee seen on youtube, social media quite readily. plus it sexualizes victims to like csam, and festishized unattainable “women” for conservatives.

      conservaties pretty much buys into/believes in anything that is scammy.

    • [deleted]@piefed.world
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      21 hours ago

      The worst thing is that when used for good AI is fantastic! Scientific progress with purpose built AI to find planets, predict the weather, and tons of pattern matching has been in use for decades with positive benefits!

      Even LLMs can be a useful tool in the right situations where looking like words people would say but accuracy is NOT important.

      The problem is trying to use LLMs to do everything and failing while running the tech industry, the environment, and soon the economy into the ground. They took something positive, ruined it and coopted the terminology while shoving it down everyone’s throats.

    • artyom@piefed.social
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      20 hours ago

      I don’t know if spending unfathomable amounts of money buying up the entire global supply of computing products can be considered a “tool”.

    • cadekat@pawb.social
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      22 hours ago

      I’m not here to argue for or against LLMs in general, but self-hostable AI is a thing. Actually open AI is a thing.

      A blanket statement saying about AI as a whole technology being good for fascism is about as useful as saying “roads are good for fascism” (they’re great for troop movement after all).

        • ugjka@lemmy.ugjka.net
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          21 hours ago

          Self hosting an llm ain’t the same thing as self hosting nextcloud for your docs and calendar. Yes there are small models but their output is laughable

          • MagicShel@lemmy.zip
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            20 hours ago

            Small models are improving and becoming more capable. The quality of local LLMs is basically unbounded. The context size of local LLMs is bounded by hardware. So local LLMs can be very capable for small, self-contained tasks.

            qwen 3.6 35b running locally:

            Write a Python script that can pull weather data from public sources and provide the high and low temperature for the current day in Miami, FL.
            

            Single shot. No tool/internet use, so it didn’t pull this script from elsewhere.

            import requests
            
            def get_miami_weather():
                # Miami, FL coordinates
                LATITUDE = 25.7617
                LONGITUDE = -80.1918
            
                # Open-Meteo API URL (free, no API key required)
                url = (
                    f"https://api.open-meteo.com/v1/forecast?"
                    f"latitude={LATITUDE}&longitude={LONGITUDE}"
                    f"&daily=temperature_2m_max,temperature_2m_min"
                    f"&timezone=auto"
                )
            
                try:
                    response = requests.get(url, timeout=10)
                    response.raise_for_status()  # Raises error for 4xx/5xx HTTP status codes
                    data = response.json()
            
                    # Index 0 corresponds to the current day
                    high_c = data["daily"]["temperature_2m_max"][0]
                    low_c = data["daily"]["temperature_2m_min"][0]
            
                    # Convert to Fahrenheit (commonly used in the US)
                    high_f = (high_c * 9/5) + 32
                    low_f = (low_c * 9/5) + 32
            
                    print("🌤️  Miami, FL Weather for Today:")
                    print(f"High: {high_f:.1f}°F ({high_c:.1f}°C)")
                    print(f"Low:  {low_f:.1f}°F ({low_c:.1f}°C)")
            
                except requests.exceptions.HTTPError as http_err:
                    print(f"❌ HTTP error occurred: {http_err}")
                except requests.exceptions.ConnectionError:
                    print("❌ Error: Could not connect to the weather API.")
                except requests.exceptions.Timeout:
                    print("❌ Error: Request timed out.")
                except requests.exceptions.RequestException as err:
                    print(f"❌ An error occurred: {err}")
                except KeyError as key_err:
                    print(f"❌ Error parsing data: Missing expected key {key_err}")
                except Exception as err:
                    print(f"❌ Unexpected error: {err}")
            
            if __name__ == "__main__":
                get_miami_weather()
            

            Output:

            % python3 ./m_weather.py
            🌤️  Miami, FL Weather for Today:
            High: 88.0°F (31.1°C)
            Low:  73.2°F (22.9°C)
            

            I tried to keep the size and scope within something that would reasonably fit in a comment. Looks pretty decent to me, but I can’t write Python myself. Never learned. I double-checked the LAT & LON of Miami, and it’s spot on.

            It did take 47 seconds, while a cloud LLM would probably take 5 or less.

            All I’m saying is local LLM isn’t garbage and it is getting better all the time.

              • chilicheeselies@lemmy.world
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                3 hours ago

                Gemma 4 e2b is pretty impressive for its size.

                This area of computer is improving very fast. I truely belive the future of this is locally installed open models

            • humanspiral@lemmy.ca
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              13 hours ago

              qwen 3.6 is awesome, but 48-64gb is still real money these days. (though 32gb on dedicated separate machine is also more money). Sonnet 3.5 to opus 4.5 level benchmarks. and the online cost metrics for 27b and 35b are way off considering the overall usefulness of a 48-64gb machine (inclusive of gpu vram for 35b) which even in single, non batching, use could displace $5-$7/day of use.

              Local costs are much lower than online costs in linked chart, but if online, there are better models

              • chilicheeselies@lemmy.world
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                3 hours ago

                Depends on if you even need a better model though. Can you run a good enough model is what matters for the most part.

            • Rimu@piefed.social
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              19 hours ago

              That’s interesting.

              How much ram did it use while running?

              If you used a GPU, how much does it cost in today’s prices?

              • MagicShel@lemmy.zip
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                15 hours ago

                It’s a MacBook Pro. 36GB of ram. I am sure Macs have some kind of gpu and I understand it somehow combines GPU ram with system ram, but I don’t really know Mac hardware very well.

                It’s beefy for a laptop, but the desktop I built for myself several years ago had 32 GB of ram and a GTX 1660, so I’m guessing they are similar in capability. I gave that to my daughter, so I can’t run a comparison right now.

                EDIT: After doing just a bit of research, I’ve learned the unified memory architecture that Macs use, while not ideal for many purposes, is actually a big advantage for running larger inference models. So it’s possible that this particular model wouldn’t run at all on my Linux box or would run much slower because the full model wouldn’t fit in the 6GB of VRAM and create a lot of memory thrashing.

                • boonhet@sopuli.xyz
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                  6 hours ago

                  Yup, you want memory accessible to the GPU for local AI. AMD Strix Point and Mac devices are popular options. CPU can run LLMs but very slowly. I’ve got 32 GB of RAM and 8 VRAM and it’s borderline useless for models that don’t fit in the VRAM.

                • SabinStargem@lemmy.today
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                  13 hours ago

                  You can use something like KoboldCPP on Linux, which allows both RAM and VRAM combined to run a model. O’course, not as fast when compared to pure VRAM or the Mac approach, but it is an option. I use my 128gb RAM with some GPUs for running models.

        • Janx@piefed.social
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          21 hours ago

          Or available. Companies have pre-sold years worth of inventory to AI companies.

        • corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca
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          22 hours ago

          You see hot that’s tangential to what you’re replying to?

          Ai is evil

          LOCAL AI is not all evil

          Computers are expensive

          Your point is completely valid, but in another discussion.

          • Fondots@lemmy.world
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            21 hours ago

            Sorry, but I think the point about local AI not necessarily being evil is the tangent here.

            The OP is about motherboard shortages, which is being driven by the big AI companies and is making hardware unaffordable for normal users

            The top level reply to that is about how that’s bad because it removes the ability for people to be in control of their own computing

            Then someone comes in, saying “yeah, but you can host your own AI so that it’s not evil so not all AI is bad”

            Then someone points out that you can only host your AI if you can afford the hardware to do so which, as the OP and the comment you replied to pointed out, is getting really hard to do.

      • Jhex@lemmy.world
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        22 hours ago

        if you did not understand the comment from above it’s fine but splitting hairs like you are doing is silly (everybody knows it’s not 100 % of AI is 100% evil)…

        your comment is exactly the same as when people say “guns don’t kill people, people kill people”… yes, we all know guns are not autonomously killing people, the point is that guns, as a tool, are remarkably good at doing something we do not want, which is to kill people

        • meco03211@lemmy.world
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          21 hours ago

          Not to go on a separate tangent, but that’s the entire point of guns. They are supposed to kill. That’s not meant to be some crazy conservative defense of them or opposition to regulating them. Just pointing out something that seems to get lost in conversations.

          • Jhex@lemmy.world
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            19 hours ago

            Correct… so when I tell you “guns DON’T kill people, people kill people” you are right to assume and I am just an idiot trying to jingle keys in front of you to distract you from the fact that guns do in fact kill people.

      • eestileib@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        22 hours ago

        Roads were also useful for random citizens and people who happened to be in the area.

        LLMs are overwhelmingly more useful to bad actors.

      • IratePirate@feddit.org
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        22 hours ago

        I’ve looked into self-hosted AI and decided it’s not worth the cost - both in terms of hardware and energy - when compared to the relative value to be gotten out of it. YMMV.

        • cadekat@pawb.social
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          18 hours ago

          Same, pretty much. It is possible though, which makes LLMs a more democratic technology than, say, nuclear reactors.

          • IratePirate@feddit.org
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            17 hours ago

            The models you can run on consumer hardware are still nowhere near the stuff that runs in corporate data centers. To stick with your metaphor, its like running a little steam engine at home while the big guys get to operate nuclear reactors…

            • cadekat@pawb.social
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              15 hours ago

              You can get pretty far with a stack of 5090s and llama.cpp with split mode graph (or so I’ve heard, I’ve never tried), or AMD’s unified memory CPU thing.

              It’s not as good as data centre grade stuff, but it’s not nothing either.

        • cadekat@pawb.social
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          18 hours ago

          That’s kinda my point. Roads are a useful technology, but they can be used by fascists.

      • Ilixtze@lemmy.ml
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        22 hours ago

        The US government is already setting down the legal framework to make self hostable AI ilegal so good luck with that. Also self hostable AI is still being trained on stolen material so still fascist.

  • DigDoug@lemmy.world
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    21 hours ago

    Motherboards were already way too goddamn expensive, anyway.

    About a year ago I was considering upgrading my AM4 PC to AM5. The rock-bottom cheapest motherboards were only slightly cheaper than the relatively high-end one I got 5-ish years ago. I decided to stick with my current PC.

    • doingthestuff@lemy.lol
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      13 hours ago

      Yeah I’m going to be running AM4, DDR4, with my 5800x for many more years the way it’s looking.

      • GenChadT@infosec.pub
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        15 hours ago

        Just repasted both of mine with phase change materials and thermal putty, including GPU dies. Looking at getting better/more fans and a smarter hub soon. Gonna make this 5800X3D last as long as possible; I’m in this for the long haul lol

    • Rai@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      16 hours ago

      I think motherboards have been pretty aptly priced. What do you think a complex piece of a computer like that should cost? The most important part of your computer that ties every single part together?

      150USD? You can get a decent board for that.

      Under 100? First of all, that’s insane, and second of all, you can get a budget board for under 100.

      350 is too much? You’re looking at a high end board. You’re paying high end board prices.

      Is your complaint that 500 is too much for a mobo? Why are you even looking at 500 dollar mobos?

      All of my boards I’ve gotten in the last five builds have been 200-300 and those are amazing machines that are either newer and excellent or older and still hold up over a decade later.

  • Asafum@lemmy.world
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    22 hours ago

    If we can’t make a time machine to go backwards, can we at least pause time? The future absolutely fucking sucks, let’s just avoid it altogether lol

    • Fishnoodle@lemmy.world
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      22 hours ago

      Seed debris in the orbit to destroy current satellites and then prevent new ones from being launched for several decades

      • Echo Dot@feddit.uk
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        21 hours ago

        Honestly I quite like space.

        Better solution is to just kill like six people. Because that’s all the AI industry is, it’s like six really annoying rich guys who are having the most extravagant pissing contest in history.

        • boonhet@sopuli.xyz
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          5 hours ago

          Six? There’s Jensen Huang, Lisa Su, Alex Karp, Peter Thiel, Sam Altman, Dario Amodei, Mark Zuckerberg, Elon Musk, Satya Nadella and Sundar Pichai at a minimum to start with, but there are many others too. I’m including the CEOs of Nvidia and AMD because they’ve been pushing AI for years to get more valuable customers than we ever were to them.

          Just in case anyone needs a list.

        • Asafum@lemmy.world
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          20 hours ago

          This is our fucking insane reality:

          Who wins? 6 rich guys or 8 Billion people?

          Easy. 6 rich guys.

          • Echo Dot@feddit.uk
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            18 hours ago

            Honestly I wouldn’t mind so much if someone created an AI that was actually useful.

  • commander@lemmy.world
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    22 hours ago

    I keep thinking maybe things will good by 2030 and remember that’s 4 years away. Game devs please target the Steam Deck and Switch 2 as the baseline. Mid range and high end is just too premium for most people. Even entry level enthusiast gaming hardware is too expensive because of memory and storage. Steam Deck and Switch 2 are good low power draw integrated graphics level. That’s not terrible for pricing

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      21 hours ago

      Even having high-end enthusiast hardware, I want those devices as the baseline too. Whatever optimizations they do still apply over the whole hardware spectrum.

      Also, you can technically say 2030 is less than 4 years away if you want to traumatize old people. Lol.

    • Echo Dot@feddit.uk
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      21 hours ago

      According to valves hardware survey over half of all gamers have hardware less powerful than the Steam Machine so provided valve don’t go mad with the pricing that may actually end up happening.

      I think the steam deck and the switch 2 are probably too low power to be reasonable targets.