• Homosexual sapiens@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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    3 days ago

    You are free to have a personal definition of the word “liberal” that differs from the widely accepted academic definition. It’s just not helpful in discussion to assume everyone else uses that definition.

    • Talcosis@lemmy.zip
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      3 days ago

      Okay.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberalism

      Yup. Checks out. Rights of the individual, government through consent, etc…sounda like I’m using the commonly accepted academic definition.

      Are you perhaps using the American definition provided by Fox News/tankies, that the meme references?

      • LemmeAtEm@lemmy.ml
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        3 days ago

        You can be anticapitalist and liberal at the same time

        No, that doesn’t even “check out” on the NATOpedia article. Even that article is explicit that liberalism is fundamentally a pro-capitalist ideology with private property as a core aspect. But it is fun watching you did a hole for yourself, step into it, then declare victory.

        And how is the OP meme referencing anything “tankies” say, other than that the person speaking in the OP image is someone you would call a “tankie”? See that little hammer and sickle next to her name? You really are deeply confused, aren’t you.

        • Talcosis@lemmy.zip
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          3 days ago

          It actually specifies property in general. Now, I know tankies like to see that and append “private” in front, but Liberalism has been around for hundreds of years longer than marxism, and prior to liberalism, property was handed out by the king, and owning property meant you were a noble.

          The idea that non-nobility can own anything, including personal property, is a liberal idea.

          • TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today
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            3 days ago

            I know tankies like to see that and append “private” in front

            Private property is meant to include personal ownership of things other than land.

            prior to liberalism, property was handed out by the king, and owning property meant you were a noble.

            You’re talking about land… In most systems of feudalism the king granted land to the landed gentry who would then rent out that land for income.

            Individuals still owned personal property like homes, businesses, and horses. They just didn’t own the land that property occupied.

            The idea that non-nobility can own anything, including personal property, is a liberal idea.

            That’s just wildly inaccurate… People have been owning different types of property since before recorded history. The only places this isn’t the cultural norm for humans in general is a select sect of small communal societies who share everything.

            There are people who will claim that the property isn’t truly owned because it’s on someone else’s land. But that would be like saying you don’t truly own your home if you have to pay property taxes.

          • RiverRock@lemmy.ml
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            3 days ago

            personal property is a liberal idea

            Hahaha holy shit man I can’t, you heard it here first folks, owning things was invented in the 1600s, nobody had stuff before that and no society had laws or ideas about it.

            • Talcosis@lemmy.zip
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              2 days ago

              Unironically yes. Only nobles owned things before that. That’s what made you a noble.

              • BanMeFromPosting@lemmy.mlBanned
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                17 hours ago

                I gotta get some of whatever it is you people are taking. The amount of confidence to talk about something I know absolutely fuck all about and just pretend I do. It’s honestly impressive that you do it as you do.

      • Doc_Crankenstein@slrpnk.net
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        3 days ago

        Liberalism is a political and moral philosophy based on the rights of the individual, liberty, consent of the governed, political equality, right to private property, and equality before the law.

        Left out a VERY important part of that definition there, bucko.

        You fundamentally cannot be a proponent of liberalism without fundamentally supporting capitalism. It’s literally part of the definition of liberalism.

        • Talcosis@lemmy.zip
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          3 days ago

          Correct. Prior to the concept of liberalism, all property was owned by the king and nobility. Liberalism includes the idea that non-nobles can own property. It also predates the distinction between private and personal property by a good 200 years.

          • zoloftt@lemmy.world
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            3 days ago

            Ah, I see, you and I are both arguing with someone who keeps hanging their hat on private property.

            It seems they all do.